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i work in AI and i think we should hit the brakes: get a better oversight mechanism in place, help local municipalities get more in exchange for building them (no more tax incentives, NDAs, high emissions power sources), those are good places to start.

rushing ahead with the 'it might destroy us but we've gotta beat China!' is silly bullshit.

And the debt financing needs to stop.

There's a sensible path forward that doesn't involve a full stop, nor maintains the previous trajectory.


really? it was more shocking to you then Jan 6?

it was more shocking than when multiple state legislators were gunned down and the shooting was blamed by Trump on Marxists? Or when Rob Reiner was shot by his son and Trump implied he had it coming?

nobody is trying to tear down AI companies. but there is a general reaction to companies and their leaders who imply that 'risk to civilization is non zero', or they need unemployment is likely, while pushing for the state to backstop them.

This take fails on even the most basic reading.


Yes, absolutely, much more shocking.

Political riots and Trump being a scumbag are well integrated into my worldview.

My coworkers making gleeful cracks about a podcaster bleeding out in front of his toddler was new information for me. I didn't realize we were so far gone.


not sure if you're dismissing this but here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_worker_deaths_in_Unite...

the reason we have weekends and no child labor is because workers died for it.

the state, the capitalists desire control, obedience and extraction. worker well-being is a low priority. workers advocating for better pay, safe working conditions, etc were routinely killed.

why is it laughable to say that there is a need to resist the injustice and push for better working conditions and rights for all?


What's the connection to the weekend?


> were routinely killed

Does that happen now? How often? Are you or your friends at risk?

> why is it laughable to say that there is a need to resist the injustice

It is not, it is normal and necessary.

Thing that is laughable is push for violence expecting a good outcome.


the stuff that elites do to people is also a violence, for example denying the lifesaving healthcare.

it is just for some reason being tolerant of abuse and exploitation is normalized, people are kept on minimum wage that hasnt changed for many decades.

elites get to enjoy the benefits of rich society only because the rest of the people tolerate it, but it doesn't have to be case


The temporarily embarrassed billionaires think they would do well without laws compensating at least some of the power differential.


there is a level of extractiveness that optimizes for overall wealth and prosperity.

and overly extractive systems are unstable over the long term.

are you confident that the current level of extraction is optimal, or sustainable?

if a large part of society decides that it's not optimal or sustainable, where would you stand? prevent change? or seek equitable and stable redistribution?

there are so many examples of the inherent unwillingness for the beneficiaries of extractive systems to resist change: see the laws imposed against serfs following the black death, or the shooting and violent suppression of striking union workers.

that cycle is beginning again: MAGA, widespread rioting in France, Italy and other places.

There is economic and political injustice. Systemic extraction is passing a stable equilibrium.

relax the grip on power and resources, or spend the blood and treasure it will cost to maintain it.

but don't bullshit anyone with this 'life has an inherent cost': that's trivially obvious to everyone.

we are well past the point of collectively paying that cost. it's just not fairly or reasonably distributed.


> are you confident that the current level of extraction is optimal, or sustainable?

No, I just don’t think a class war is the answer. Equitable and stable resource distribution doesn’t necessitate retribution towards the current ruling class. An imperfect system beats no system at all.


thats what a ruling class representative would say. But historically elite rotation and elite replacement happened routinely, often violently, because they extracted too much and lost touch with reality


And you sound like an internet revolutionary who’s never encountered actual violence


I have in fact encountered actual violence and was an active participant in two revolutions in one of the former USSR countries


How safe would you feel knowing that yesterday your neighbour killed 3 rich guys (and probably redistributed their stuff)?

Starting tradition of violence is easier than stoping it.


Terrible. Which is exactly why people are trying to feed forward the message in discussion forums, before it actually turns violent. The problem is that the elites still aren't listening - rather they keep doubling down, as they've been quite successful at redirecting the energy to serve their own ends (eg the maggot movement for the latest incarnation, which is plainly obvious to everybody who isn't part of the maggot movement). But eventually that trick is going to fail, and the longer it has gone on, the harder the fall will be.


rich people are innocent, my issue is with elites in the higher echelons of power (not necessarily wealth) who are corrupt and do not deserve the place they are in.


90% of the revolutions I’m aware of historically had clear negative effects for everyone afterwards.

What do you think our odds would be?


One of them gave us independent America


Run the numbers yet on the odds of getting that side of the die twice in a row?


uhhh, try being the child or family member of a problem gambler. almost as consequential as drugs or alcohol in my experience.


>There haven't been any good options for president in a long time.

that does not justify voting for the worst candidate for this office in as many decades.

this argument immediately pops up. and it's easily refuted: just don't vote for the guy convicted of felonies and with a long history of boorish behavior and grift. it's really not that hard.


i think racist is a projection.

example: I'm a new Zealander.

i don't want Americans immigrating in large quantities to New Zealand, because they have cultural values that change the nature of the society, in ways that i don't want it to change.

And i don't consider American a 'race', but more an agglomeration pf people with some general preferences, shared experience and even material characteristics ($$$) that will have negative impacts.

Now, if i could filter, as a voter, to 'allow in Americans that share my values and that would minimize change on axes that matter to me', i would accept immigration of Americans.

but, as a voter, i cannot do that. So instead i vote to keep immigration restrictive. that does not mean I consider Americans inferior, not that i hold that they are meaningfully different from me in any way except culture.

it's not racism. but instead a generalization that we are forced to apply as individuals.

does that change your perspective on this?


it's possible to believe in democracy in principle and also understand that we are too far gone to either recover or find an alternative.

we let the rot grow for too long.


I'm reading "why nations fail" and it's fascinating to learn how deliberately Apartheid South Africa was engineered to impoverish black farmers to improve profitability for whites.

Feels like a very similar policy being pursued here.


are you american protestant perchance? your perspective is shaped by your cultural milieu and is not a firm objective fact.

i get much more satisfaction out of preparing a meal or reading a good book than work. i like to choose what i work on, rather than be told by the prevailing wage rate what work i should do.

caring for a child is one of the most valuable and rewarding activities, but it is not rewarded monetarily. that doesn't make it less valuable or worthwhile.


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