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What do you hope to accomplish by that statement?

Do you think this will motivate people who may have voted for trump but been ok the fence by calling them stupid?

Is it to help give a better alternative or actionable advice? Does it contribute anything to the discussion?

It seems it primarily exist to give you a hit of self righteous dopamine while attempting to create further rifts between individuals.

help



At some point the emperor should be made aware that he's naked, even if it hurts his feelings to find out.

He just kicked out those meanies from the press room for saying hurtful things.

Far more useful would be to wonder for a moment why people voted that way, especially since I would wager no small part of the reason is because people are living in different realities stemming from hyper-targeted curated clickbait slop

And racism

Oh, did racism in the US suddenly increase? More than the days of, say, Jim Crow or the Ku Klux Klan, or Operation Wetback, or..?

Between "Kavanaugh stops" (aka police harassment of brown-skinned people) and racial gerrymandering being brought back (and Mississippi GOP immediately celebrating it in the old capitol associated with Jim Crow), what do you think?

Given that those things existed in the past, I don't think they are sufficient to explain the more unique situation of the present, and thus also don't offer a compelling avenue to counteract it

Coddling the southern segregationist isn't what led to equal civil rights. It was a fight and it wasn't all nonviolent.

If that fight were to happen again, but the surrounding media environment setup didn't much change, do you think the resulting changes would be long-lasting?

Are you denying Trump is openly racist? I thought that was now accepted by the right, and that the new strategy was to instead explain how being racist isn’t actually that bad. Why would you have such a knee jerk reaction?

Because it's a facile non-explanation to say people voted for Trump simply because of racism. If we're providing simplistic one-word reasons I'd proffer "inequality"

It’s not simply because they and trump are racist. It’s because they are racist and other reasons. But racism is definitely one of the major factor. The idea that racism is a simplification is absurd, trump supporters are very openly racist and in support of white nationalism ideals. It’s not subtle, it’s not hidden.

I see that you didn’t answer my questions though


"Is Trump racist?" and "do racists vote for Trump?" are different questions from "did Trump get elected because of racism?"

I don't think the amount of racism in the US suddenly increased from its baseline*, and thus I think that writing off his electoral victory as "because racism" and nothing more than that is an uninteresting feel-better exercise

*Even one inch deeper of an analysis would be more interesting, like if someone countered with "Well, I think the election of Obama was a bridge too far for racists that had previously been quietly holding their noses" or something. On the other hand, both Obama and Trump were the "change" candidate against the "status quo" candidate.


Except Obama was the "change" choice to move things forward, while Trump is the "change" choice to move things backwards - you could even say that it is the "info change" candidate.

And what is changing things backwards? Yes, it is getting back to good old racism and putting white people above anything colored.


Riddle me this: why did people with immigrant spouses/families vote for Trump and then end up surprised to find them on the chopping block? Over and over you hear "but Trump said he was going to go after the criminals" (also "no new wars"). You may have known better but that doesn't mean the general population is particularly effective at lie detection. Which goes back to my original statement: "people are living in different realities" because they are being fed completely different news and media. Target this post code and tell them Trump is better (or Harris is worse) for Palestine. Target that post code and tell them Trump is better (or Harris is worse) for Israel. And so on.

You really think they are hapless to notice the lies? Trump has been on camera for decades. He was the butt of the joke for the Simpsons and countless shows. That was far before he got into politics!

The reality (that those people will never tell you about, instead pretending to be surprised) is that they knew he lied, but to others, and that he was going to shaft the others but not them. Why do you think people "fall" for scams like pyramid schemes? They know it is "too good to be true" but they think they are the ones that will scam others, they will get out of the scheme on top. Here they think others will get screwed more than they will; they thought Trump would ruin and destroy the woke, the women, the trans, the brown-skinned, the most recent immigrants, and they would have never cared a single second about it; but now he has driven up the price of gas and stuff, and they are suffering as much as everyone else; that is what is unacceptable, and a treason, for them.

You pretend people mean what they say and that they can be reasoned with; I say, and everyone who actually interacted with MAGA knows this, that the whole movement is based on bad faith and dog whistles and stuff that can't be said out loud. The lies, the pretense is there to toy with you, they are in on the joke and you are not.


>why people voted that way

"Fuck your feelings"


> Do you think this will motivate people who may have voted for trump but been ok the fence by calling them stupid?

Yes. That's been a surprising and important lesson of the Trump movement's success; we've learned that insulting your political opponents can help convince fence-sitters, and doesn't automatically repel them. I wish it weren't so, but in the modern political climate, abandoning insults seems as strategically unwise as abandoning fundraising.


we need an irony hall of fame for this forum



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