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Suspected sabotage causes major Netherlands rail disruption (bbc.com)
528 points by choult 8 days ago | rank | favorite | 44 comments
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Just days after a similar (criminal) incident causing a train to derail in France: https://www.lemonde.fr/en/france/article/2026/09/12/french-p...

"close to Renault's factory in the town of Cléon", which is now preparing to start manufacturing drones for the French military, in collaboration with Ukrainian military-industrial groups.


I don't think they look similar, the synchronicity notwithstanding. The sabotage in France was a 250–300 kg rail fragment (per your link). The objects in the Netherlands look much smaller, and look like they're intended to short-circuit two rails to trigger a signal fault. In one place they found car jumper cables with clamps attached to both rails,

https://nos.nl/video/2631081-startkabels-van-spoor-bij-meppe... ("Startkabels van spoor bij Meppel weggehaald")


Not asserting this is definitely a Russian op (given the amount of simultaneous farmers' protests and all in NL today), but their modus operandi for foreign operations of this kind involves paying random thugs a few hundred to a couple thousand euros to carry out acts of sabotage using whatever items they have on hand. The items don't need to match, the people involved don't need to know each other.

Correct, this is their exact MO and has been for decades. "Random thug" recruitment notwithstanding, part of the point of such ops is to prove to themselves that they can, in fact, reach out and touch a target - i.e., exercising the entire operational chain from C&C down to the minutiae of execution. A kind of integration test for sabotage, if you will. (Not saying this specific incident is or isn't anything in particular, just commenting on the general MO.)

If one were in a charitable mood, one could think of this as a "just in case" measure of ongoing capability assurance in the event of a broader conflict. In a less charitable mood, one might imagine it as preparation for proactive action. In either case, if you don't do this kind of sub-threshold stuff at least occasionally, you often discover that when a real conflict erupts, the capabilities you thought you had are in fact literally or figuratively rusty. (See the Russian army's logistical debacle early in the Ukraine war for a recent example.)

Most top tier nation states do some version of this; each one has its own style. The Russians are somewhat unusual in that they care less than most who knows or suspects them of this kind of activity.


France does some version or style of derailing Russian trains, you say?

Not exactly "random thugs", but this comes to mind:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinking_of_the_Rainbow_Warrior

>The sinking of Rainbow Warrior, codenamed Opération Satanique, was an act of French state-terrorism carried out on 10 July 1985. The event was described by France as a "covert operation" by the "action" branch of the French foreign intelligence agency, the Directorate-General for External Security (DGSE). During the operation, two operatives (both French citizens) sank the flagship of the Greenpeace fleet, Rainbow Warrior, at the Port of Auckland on her way to a protest against a planned French nuclear test in Moruroa. Fernando Pereira, a photographer, drowned on the sinking ship.


France provides Ukraine with targeting information that allows Ukraine to strike deep inside Russia, including industrial targets. So France is directly contributing to attacks against non-military target in Russia, yes.

Source: https://www.kyivpost.com/post/81382


Hm, if Russia were to seriously deploy that logic to justify sabotage in European countries (insofar as a kleptocratic dictatorship is ever serious or logical), it could backfire a bit:

1. If France is a sabotage-justified enemy, then so is the US, which provides some intelligence to Ukraine.

2. In the other direction, Russia has been giving targeting information and weapons to Iran to attack the US forces. So if they're the enemy of the US, then certain members of the current Republican administration may have to tone down their "aid and comfort" for Russia lest it mean future treason charges.


Russia has traded Iran drones in exchange for Iranian artillery rounds to use in Ukraine.

And China has sent Iran anti air missiles and provides Russia and Iran with targeting data.

And North Korean troops all over Russia...

It's a shitshow.


If their foreign intelligence office hasn't made the kind of contacts and capabilities that could, they wouldn't be doing their jobs.

Low level sabotage under the guise of hooliganism wasn't invented in Leningrad.


or make it look like it was the Russians so you can get the public on board with a war against Russia?

Or make it look like you're trying to make it look like it was the Russians so you can get the public on board with a war against NATO?

Bet you didn't see the uno reverso false false flag coming


What's the logic? Russia sabotages NATO infrastructure, claims innocence, and this is somehow supposed to generate support for war against NATO?

Yes. They need to justify a mobilization.

Does the West (EU/UK/USA) take any responsibility for creating conditions that made this war in Ukraine possible? Its ALL Russia's fault?

Does turkey take any responsibility for the Ottoman empire creating conditions that made blocking the straits of Hormuz possible?

Huh? I'm talking about 2000-2022. Do you even know anything about Ukraine and what has being on there?

Shouldn't you be shit-posting on Twitter/X? Is that all you do is shit-post?


Like when we claimed that the russians had sabotaged their own pipeline rather than just stop pumping gas, after Biden declared he'd blow that thing up in case of conflict, and we are still supposed to believe it was the russians?

Exactly this, and also they are trying to keep some deniability here, so variations are good.

Why would you want to keep it deniable? What's the point in this sort of sabotage if nobody knows you did it?

The ideal scenario is everyone suspects it's you but can't prove it.

You have both the desired threat, but no concrete biases for an official response.

Also an uncertainty limits action - it might be a random event, it could even be a false flag.

One of the problem's here is narratives are being spun by multiple actors and it depends on who you believe.


> The ideal scenario is everyone suspects it's you but can't prove it.

Why? EU countries have shown time and time again they won't do anything. I mean for God's sake, Russia was caught sending THREE remote controlled flying bomb on a German airfield, with another one found by a passerby before it was launched.

They contained professionally made Russian explosives. There is no doubt who did it. This was not the first, or the 10th time they got caught. I mean Russia murdered someone in the UK with polonium, for God's sake.

The idea that the Kremlin is worried in the slightest that you can prove it's them is absurd. They leave their fingerprints knowing there will be no reaction.


> The idea that the Kremlin is worried in the slightest that you can prove it's them is absurd.

I mean they are. That is the reason they haven’t sent balistic missiles to the same airfield. They could have sent the same agents who placed those drones to the fence of the airport with a shoulder mounted missile and shot down the planes as they were departing. Or even shoot them down on the ground.

Or similarly they could send a submarine and disrupt the railway services of the Netherlands with missiles from that.

Those would be clearly attributable actions which trigger an immediate military response. That is the reason why they don’t do them.

You look at the actions they take and conclude that they don’t have any restraint or worries. But you should also be looking at the actions they could have but did not take to see that they are in fact restrained and probably quite a bit worried. If they werent they would play the game differently.


Because the Kremlin wants europe to take an overt action to justify mobilization. There are many better assymetric ways for europe to retaliate.

I think it's to slowly increase offenses _that won't lead to military response_. The response to each individual incident, worse than the one before, kinetic action can be delayed because "this was only a little worse than the last one".

This compounds because NATO needs to act collectively to effectively act militarily (maybe Poland could go it alone).


It's European countries that are taking this strategy, any Russia sabotage is aimed at deterring this widening of the conflict - not to encourage it.

Originally Europe didn't want to supply tanks, then it was only short range missiles, then it was longer range missiles as long as they weren't used to attack targets inside Russia - now it's actively supporting doing military strikes deep into Russia, and openly talking about European boots on the ground in Ukraine ( not that they likely didn't have deniable special forces there from the beginning ).

Strategically it's not in Russia's interests at all to have a wider escalation right now - they have their hands full. Any Russia sabotage is a direct response to missiles and drones using Western technology blowing up warehouses and oil installations deep inside Russia - widening the war is not in their interest or their aim here - they are trying to deter that.

There is the wider question of whether Russia's long term goal is to take back the old soviet states bit by bit in a way that doesn't trigger a full response - but I'd argue there is already a clear red line there - and that's the Nato border.


Europe could just conscript migrants for the AFU but alas it's politically impossible. Would at least prevent the domestic anti NATO propaganda.

The famous salami tactic (Yes, Minister)

> Because the Kremlin wants europe to take an overt action to justify mobilization.

Do they? Why? They're already in a stalemate of a conflict, why would they want more fully-mobilized enemies?


Russia wants an excuse to justify mobilization in Russia, not in Europe.

Really? Unless they are complete morons they realize something. If you take EU governments, any random country, as a general rule government expenditures go like this:

35% pensions (usually also has some health care here)

35% social security and health care

15% education

15% everything else, roads, bridges, government buildings, ... (army is in here @ maybe 5%)

They're also drowning in debt, of the non-tiny, only Germany does better than the US. So they can't realistically borrow to finance this for 5 years. They're trying to cheat, and treat the EU like a separate country (meaning get investors to treat the EU as a separate state that is not on the hook for the debt of member countries but levies it's own taxes, then borrow against that, but EU countries are cheating, for example using money the EU borrowed for military purposes to fund general expenses like fixing roads)

If the EU countries mobilize the army will go to 20-25% of government expenditures easily.

That means either pensions or social security HAVE TO go down 15% (or 7.5% each). That will cause a revolt since a great many people can't survive like that. At that point there will be no choice for a lot of people but to tear the government down.

That may be the plan of course.


part of the answer is the peace time dividend. the decrease in european spending has mostly been used for lowering or abolishing taxes on the corporations and the wealthy. if this was to be reversed (because we're not in a peace time anymore), the added tax income could be used to finance the re-armament.

The usual people revolting will be in Russia post mobilisation

Just send more aid to Ukraine and it will be raining oil again in Moscow.

i agree with this. the kremlin sees this as a win-win strategy. there are two options:

1. either their actions are ignored by the victim states, which makes this very cheap and effective sabotage to weaken EU members.

2. or alternatively, if there's military retaliation, putin can finally do the mobilization he promised not to do for his war on ukraine, because he can now assert that the country is under attack by foreign nations.

the EU / the member states are now in a pickle: they know it's russia but can't say it out loud because then they'd have to take action. they also can't do nothing because then russian sabotage could wreak havoc with the population and economy. so what can they do?

1. military support of ukraine 2. further sanctions of the russian economy, which includes getting rid of dependencies on russian goods 3. re-arming and modernizing their own military (i.e. introducing modern drone warfare capability, launching their own satelite intelligence, ...) 4. start opposing/controlling russian influence by local malicious actors, i.e. russia friendly right wing political parties (which is somewhat complicated but not impossible in a democratic setting)


Because being too blatant will galvanize the public and create support for open war.

The goal is to ensure all reasonable people know, while keeping enough deniability that Russian-funded right-wing groups can sow doubt about attribution and response policy’s

They don’t care whether it can be proven in court or by people paying close attention. They care whether it can’t be denied even by their aligned agents in western countries.


Maybe it depends on the country, but here the public automatically assumes everything like this done by Russia and these increase support for open war. I don't think Russia wants deeper European involvement in the war, so I'm having trouble understanding why Russia would be doing this. They're already having difficulties in Ukraine, how would angering the European public and increasing the support for further involvement help Russia achieve its goals?

Indeed, maybe it depends on the country.

In many countries, russia’s psyop tactics do work frighteningly well, and we see this resulting in a renaissance of the far-right, who are explicitly against supporting Ukraine, and explicitly seek the rehabilitation of russia.


Exactly. If anything, the country that would benefit most from heightened Europe-Russia tensions (as a result of these sorts of infrastructure "accidents") isn't even on the continent. I'm not ruling out Russia completely, but it would sure be stupid for them to effect this strategy. Additionally, Russians weren't the ones that blew up a pipeline at the start of the Russia-Ukraine war.

The Russians have learned from the best.

Look up how successful the US has been in getting right wing crazy people elected as the heads of state in nearly every Central and South American country by funding right-wing groups, with the exception of Mexico and Brazil (but top minds are working on this).


Russia has been trying to get locals to elect governments on their side and even revolt and destroy their own countries to do so ... since 1917. They used the red army to make this happen in most of Eastern Europe, half of Asia, Africa, South America, Middle America ... and they're still at it in quite a few places (like Africa). They fought until their state collapsed to change the government in Afghanistan.

Just because the US does something bad, does not mean others don't do 100x worse. In both meanings of the word.


> Middle America

I thought I loved Red Dawn, I rewatched it recently, it's really stupid.


Right, but you absolutely need the suspicion. If it's too deniable, it rather loses efficacy. It seems in this situation it could be any number of actors, which rather dilutes any intended message.

You don't need a real basis for a response. There's nobody here enforcing any rules.

If you wanted you could claim you have evidence, without having any. Doesn't matter.

"This better stop or there will be sanctions, and if its not within your power to stop it, tough luck" is a valid response.

Whether that's wise is another question.

Here's a recent example where Germany so far claimed that it tied the attack to Russia, but whether that's actually true is anyone guess (since there's little publicly verifiable information released so far): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2026_Leipzig_Airport_drone_att...

It wouldn't be terribly surprising if Russia was behind it, but on the other hand it wouldn't be the first false flag incident of this war either.




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